DD, snow, dirt, rallycross prep

[Planespotting]

So if I want my Saabaru to handle dirt fireroads, plenty of snowy roads, and some RallyX action what would be the mods list?

Currently:
Front & Rear sways are 20mm (that's a rear upgrade)
AVO front endlinks
Group N Trans mount
STi catback exhaust (for the sound)
Primitive skid plate and diff protector
K&N Air Filter


I don't like how the rear sway has affected winter handling and may change back to a 17mm bar. Summer road performance doesn't need to be superb, the motorcycles take care of that need. I am also planning on picking up some Braid Winrace T Acropolis SSE wheels for RallyX and winter duties. Summer may see some 17" or 18" Rota Torques with summer only performance tires.

Given that I am spending more time off tarmac,how would you set up a DD?

[pomspeed]

Mudflaps would be other thing to add. Your list will fill most of the rallyx needs. Driving is the biggest thing that you can't buy.

Brent

[edrach]

Here's the list I compiled for the WCSS12 show last year. This didn't happen all at once (I don't have that much extra bucks to spare) but two or three mods per year worked out well for me.


1997 Impreza L wagon


Daily driver, rallycross car, and TSD rally car

Sump guard by Primitive racing, Tigard
Rear diff guard by Subaru
Rear sway bar from WRX (20mm)
Front sway bar from RS Impreza
Front and rear strut bars from craigslist
Rebuilt stock EJ22 engine by At Your Service Autocare, Snohomish
JDM 5MT transmission from corkysrocks (modified and installed by At Your Service Autocare)
JDM limited slip differential (4.111) from corkysrocks and installed by him
Rear disk brakes from 93 Legacy wagon (via Pull a Part) and installed by corkysrocks
Custom stainless steel brakelines by Pacific Import Auto, Tacoma
Hankook rally tires by Trackside Motorsports, Portland
AGX shocks/struts by KYB and installed by Superior Import Repair, Portland
WRX front seats from craigslist
Chronar TSD Rally computer
Hall effect speed sensor by Chronar
Custom rally computer mount by Primitive Racing, Tigard
Whiteline Anti-lift kit by Rallitek, Portland (installed by qman)
Scanguage II from Rallitek, Portland
Perfect Power 6 engine management from USMB and installed by Rallitek, Portland
Competition Brake pads (front and rear) by Primitive Racing, Tigard

I've always felt that protection and reliability were my priority. The go fast mods were the last to be installed. My car currently has 205K miles on the chassis and I'm planning on keeping it for many years more.

And as Brent mentioned, driving experience and practice means a lot. I was a navigator most of my rally years and never understood how my drivers managed what they do; it was all black magic to me.

I cannot thank Paul Eklund and his Primitive Rally School enough for the things I learned there and the seat time I got. I've made it my practice to attend the March school just to get the cobwebs out of my system and continue to learn. I am a slow learner, but I'm getting to where I want to be.

[RSTi]

ive always read that for rallycross its best to remove the sway bars. other wise mudflaps id say your list is looking pretty good.

[edrach]

ive always read that for rallycross its best to remove the sway bars. other wise mudflaps id say your list is looking pretty good.I've never heard of removing the swaybars (but that's just me). My car came with four mudflaps so I never thought to add them to my list. If I had more power, I'd consider increasing the size of the stock mudflaps.

[RSTi]

ive read on here that removing the sway bars is beneficial in rallyx cause it allows a little more individual corner suspension movement. to be honest though i cant confirm this from experience cause my car came without sway bars so i dont know how it handles with them on. lol.

then again ive also been told that softer suspensions are better for rallyx yet for my first rallyx (the only one ive run) i firmed the suspension up (adjustable struts) and it handled phenominally. in the end i guess it really comes down to what works best for you and your driving style

[edrach]

then again ive also been told that softer suspensions are better for rallyx yet for my first rallyx (the only one ive run) i firmed the suspension up (adjustable struts) and it handled phenominally. in the end i guess it really comes down to what works best for you and your driving styleI'm a believer in softer suspension for rallycross. I think my old springs and soft settings for the AGX shocks tend to keep the wheels on the ground rather than bouncing around. Works for me.

[A1337STI]

I like your mod list. I'm not too familiar with the dirt roads in your area, in my area you can take a stock STI down ... pretty much every road i drive with out damaging it. so i don't need extra ride height or crazy tall tires ...

I'de consider some AGX struts . think they are around $532 from summit racing. Do the bounce test to see if your struts are good or not, if they are blown new struts is a very nice upgrade.

Tires! i like to check out tire rack, in their ultra high All Season , or high performance All Season. (the higher performance category usually gives you stiffer sidewalls) and the all seasons are snow rated, sort by "light snow" and that's a good ball park estimator for dirt traction. deep snow = mud traction. :)

a limited slip would also be a nice add on. I know adding one changed my Adventure / dirt road driving. there's an OBX front for around $350 , and you can usually find a rear VLSD for $250 , you can find them for cheaper ($50 in a pick and pull) and online just be patient and keep searching.

Also try playing with some softer swaybars , you can find a 13 mm rear , and down to a 17 front. I've (only once) Tried taking off my sways for rally cross and while it felt better my times were slower. You soften up your spring rate by doing so, and you gain some better independent action. BUT that comes at the cost of body roll. which does a few bad things.
1) body roll = more weight transfer
2) you end up with dynamic postive camber on your outside wheel (basically your tire just became very narrow and i hope you have good traction with your sidewalls)
3) you are slightly more likely to roll over.


But there are plenty of drivers who are Very fast and don't like sways. you'll have to experiment. its best to go to a rally cross and dissconnect a sway bar after a few runs. (or reconnect) which ever way you think will be slower you should try last (when you are more familiar with the course and should be faster yourself)

It also depends on your spring rates Quite a bit!!!

[LPPrelude]

Just take it out on the dirt. Then worry about upgrades/fixing things later.

Mudflaps and a skidplate are two very good things to pick up at the start..everything else is not important until you get some seat time. That's what it is about right, seat time?

[edrach]

Just take it out on the dirt. Then worry about upgrades/fixing things later.

Mudflaps and a skidplate are two very good things to pick up at the start..everything else is not important until you get some seat time. That's what it is about right, seat time?Seat time is invaluble. Worth more than any of the gofast mods you can add to your car.

[Planespotting]

It's not so much the "go fast" I'm looking for as it is sturdy. Although improved off tarmac handling as well could be seen as go fast parts.

[LPPrelude]

Skidplate, mudflaps and a Snell2000 or newer helmet then go to a rallyx

:headbang:
Side note a Mazda on it's roof goes MOOZ MOOZ :rofl:

[noisycricket]

You soften up your spring rate by doing so, and you gain some better independent action. BUT that comes at the cost of body roll. which does a few bad things.
1) body roll = more weight transfer

Body roll has nothing at all do to with CAUSING weight transfer, it only results from it. At least, at the CG/track width/lean angles that we normally will see, any theoretical difference in weight transfer is like worrying about what gear you're in because the shifter knob changes the car's weight distribution. (I listen to 107.9 because that balances the car better, too :) )

When we start rallycrossing radio towers, then we can worry about it :) But when cars lean at absolute maximum five degrees, the CG is only moving a quarter, maybe a half inch. The suspension geometry will have a far larger effect on weight transfer than the direct effects of body roll.

Now, large amounts of body roll DO affect the responsiveness of the car, which may or may not be a good thing depending on driving style - a smooth driver who just threads cones will not be affected as much as a throw-and-catch driver. It can and can make things "scary" in certain conditions, like sliding over rippled ground, or driving through a grippy slalom. Especially that one.


Now, if you are having enough body roll that you run out of suspension travel and top out or bottom out the suspension, then that will greatly increase weight transfer for a moment.